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Hello, this is the Migraine Heroes podcast, a podcast where we share real stories from
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real people suffering and battling with migraine disease.
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In this podcast, we seek to provide support, hope, holistic health advocacy, and inspiration
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for those who suffer from migraines.
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Hello, thank you very much Samantha for joining me today.
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You're welcome, it's nice to be here.
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Yeah, it's very nice that we're in person, we're in New Zealand, and it's actually the
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first time that we meet in person.
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Yeah, yeah, it's really nice.
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I can't even think how long we've been doing this.
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Yeah, quite a few months.
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It's funny, like even when I opened the door, I had that slight hesitation, have we ever
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But now we both know we haven't, so it's really good to see you, and thank you for making
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the time, and thank you for, you know, accepting to do this for all of these women.
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Any help, because I think it's changed my life, so.
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Okay, so let's just go right in.
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So when did migraines start for you?
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I think when I was, I was going to say puberty, but it was before puberty.
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I think 11, 12, something like that.
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And in my family, we called them headaches.
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My mom had headaches, but not the kind that in my head I associated later on with migraines.
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You know, she wouldn't be in bed in a dark room, she'd just say, I have a headache today.
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And so when I was growing up at school, I'd be in the nurse's office getting paracetamol
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So how does that work?
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Well, you just go to the nurse and say, I've got a headache, and the nurse gives you some
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And then after a while, it sort of, when I was about 14, my parents were like, hang on,
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they're getting more insistent and more frequent.
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So I went to see a neurologist, and I went and had an MRI, nothing wrong.
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The GP put me on migraine tablets, didn't work, and the consensus was, it's not a migraine,
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So what is the difference then?
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One is less intense than the other?
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Intense, yeah, because I wasn't having to go and lie down.
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Because there was no aura?
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There was no aura, there was no floating things, there was no, you know, it wasn't, it was
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impacting my life, but it wasn't impacting my life.
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Yeah, a little bit, I mean.
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But I wasn't, you know, I wasn't stopping myself doing things.
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I was still going to school.
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And we also thought possibly it was because I was vegetarian, didn't like drinking a lot.
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So that seems to tie in quite a lot.
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Drinking water, you mean?
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Couldn't be bothered to drink.
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Typically English.
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And then when I was in my 20s, I was in quite a high pressure job and I remember going and
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seeing another neurologist.
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And that neurologist said to me, do you exercise?
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That was his take.
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And I said, no, because I'm too busy working.
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Oh, well, you know, you should bring some exercise into your life.
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There's nothing wrong with you.
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That's what will do it.
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So I brought exercise into my life.
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I didn't have a bad headache, but probably I felt better all around.
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So can you describe a day when you have a headache, like you wake up, you were waking
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up with them, would they differ?
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Would they always be in the same location?
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Usually in the same location, often around my eyes.
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Not so I could understand it.
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I wouldn't go, oh, here.
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You know, it's just be around my eyes.
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But it might start on the right and move to the left.
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And then when I was, I remember, because I can remember the places I was working at,
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one magazine, I had a girlfriend who would always say to me, I can tell you've got a
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headache because your eyes kind of go like that.
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You've got a headache happening.
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Like, did she have migraines herself?
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No, she just looked at me and she'd go, you've got a headache, haven't you?
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I'd be like, yeah.
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So actually in my head, when I, it was, when you talk about it, I remember you, no, I went
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to see a neurologist over here as well because, so I realized as I think about it, this has
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And so in my 20s, late 20s, I went to see somebody, then I went to see a nutritionist
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who said, honestly, all you've got to do is drink water.
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So I had all these different ideas.
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I'm not, I'm a vegetarian, but I'm not a clever vegetarian.
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I'm not eating all the pulse and beans.
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I just don't like meat and fish.
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And, you know, I should be drinking more water, I should be exercising, which is fair enough.
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You know, that's, that's usually a good call, exercise more, drink more water.
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But still nothing was cracking it.
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No, nothing was cracking it.
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And then how, would it be every day or would it be?
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I'd say four or five days out of the week, but again, yeah, but it's not the kind of,
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it wasn't debilitating.
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I wasn't on the floor.
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You know, when I came to see you, it was debilitating.
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I was in bed for a week, vomiting, not able to move because I had what they called vestibular
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So then I had the aura up until then.
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So two years ago, I, yeah, about two years ago, I started getting vestibular migraines.
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And that's a whole different story.
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Let's, let's stay a little bit backwards.
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So like you're, wow, you're like as a, as a, as a, as a child, like you have headaches
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and there's sort of no explanation for it, but sort of, yeah, it's your fault.
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You know, that's what you get.
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Some people get headaches.
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Some people, I don't know, have blue eyes.
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But were you satisfied with that answer?
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If you can't, if, um, you know, you can take some pills and they'll probably help.
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If I take Nirofen, I'll be okay.
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Or Paracetamol, you know, your chances are you'll be okay.
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So it's not, so in the end, it's not the end of the world.
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You're having to take them.
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You have to be aware that you shouldn't have them on an empty tummy and that kind of thing.
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As you grew up, were you drinking a lot or were you having quite a healthy lifestyle?
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I said, you know, maybe early twenties, I did some drinking, but not crazy.
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I've never smoked.
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Um, uh, and now I, you know, and then I went off drink.
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I don't, I don't really drink, drink much.
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Because you know, it's not debilitating, but you've also not pushed the envelope.
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So you had something lingering, but it never escalated also because you were good to yourself.
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Although I had quite a pressure job and I think that's when the headaches came.
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And, um, and also, so there are lots of other contributing facts, I think, you know, I sit
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at a desk writing.
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And as I sit there.
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And it's only since, um, maybe the last few years.
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So I had, uh, uh, there was something else I was going to say.
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No, I can't remember.
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There was another situation.
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Maybe 10 years ago, I started really working out crazy.
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And I really got into boxing after it.
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And I really loved it.
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I would have not picked that up.
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I used to punch my trainer and then say, sorry.
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It wasn't my natural.
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She wasn't hysterical.
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Um, and then one day I had a coffee.
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I came back and I thought I was having a stroke.
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I had the most cracking headache I've ever had in my life.
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And I was on the floor saying to my husband, you've got to call the ambulance.
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I'm having a stroke.
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And I was saying, you know, can you see, am I raising my hands?
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All the things you're going to do.
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He's like, yeah, you're fine.
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And he was busy Googling.
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And he said, it's, it's because of the, it's because of the coffee and the exercise.
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And then eventually I took later.
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I understand your body from within, which for you would have been a.
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And I think that that would have been a, you know, a bad combination, but it's not an unusual
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combination for most people.
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And then, but so I kind of realized, okay, if I didn't look after myself on an exercise
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and something crazy is going to happen because that's like, that wasn't a headache that was
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a, an intense situation.
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You know, it's really, I thought, oh my, and I don't, I'm touch wood.
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I've never been an ill person, you know, I had a headache, but I've never been sick.
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Anyway, and then what happened to you then?
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So you're like on the floor, he's googling and then.
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And then I went to the doctor.
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I said, listen, this has happened.
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I just want to double check that nothing, he said, no, no, it's classic symptom of,
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you know, you've, you've exercised too much and you've got a migraine.
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And I spoke to my brother and my brother said, oh yeah, that's what I get when I, if I have
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chocolate before I work out really hard because one of my brothers works out very strongly.
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So, so there was that exercise one.
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And then when I got here and I had that, I had some, maybe I had two cases of the exercise
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induced migraine where I realized, okay, I've got to be a bit cautious here.
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There's something going on, more than a headache.
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And then I forgot about it.
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We moved over here to New Zealand and all was fine.
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And then an intense period of stress for various reasons.
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And that suddenly brought on vestibular migraine, which was the most physical expression of
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a headache I've ever felt in my life.
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I didn't understand it was a headache at first.
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I thought, what's going on again?
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You know, I had the headache, but more impressive was the dizziness.
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I couldn't move without feeling I was going to vomit.
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And if I did move, I would vomit.
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So it was very, it was very, um, I'll say that again.
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So if you were moving, you'd vomit.
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And moving could be that.
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It could be very, very.
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So I was stitching.
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So not only was I stressed because of what was going on around me, but, um, I was also
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physically, uh, yeah.
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And I was, I was, um, um, what do you call it?
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I was sort of making it even worse because I was having to sit like this because if I
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knew if I moved, I'd be sick.
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And then I did some, I went to see the doctor.
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I remember going to the doctor and being sick in the car and I'm sick and I'm having to
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pull over because I, you know, it was just that constant feeling.
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And they did the something maneuver.
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Now I've forgotten the name, you know, when you're twisted, twisted to try and fix it.
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Um, and they did lots of hearing tests, again, more MRIs and I was sent to a neurologist
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and he said, classic case of vestibular migraine.
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Have you got migraine in your family?
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And I said, think again.
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Have you got family?
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My brother gets it when he's, but only when he's worked out.
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And my mom said she had headaches.
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And then my dad, there was a couple of times when my dad said he had things floating.
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And you didn't think of yourself?
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I didn't think of it because I don't think of myself having a migraine.
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I think of having headaches.
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Oh, that's incredible.
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So he puts that name on vestibular migraine so that it had a sense.
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And potentially something to do with menopause maybe, something to do with hormonal fluctuations,
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something to do with stress.
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Um, and says, okay, so I would suggest you take amitriptyline.
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Which is an old fashioned antidepressant, but this isn't because I think you're depressed.
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It's because it's been shown to work very well at stress relief.
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So I thought, yeah.
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And he said that it has the added benefit of, um, allowing you to sleep.
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So you will sleep well like a baby.
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So, um, I don't love taking medication.
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I feel like I've had enough of my neurofan and paracetamol doses over the years.
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So he's told me to take a such and such amount.
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So I, my instinct was to do half.
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And it worked like a dream.
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And then I became very, um, reliant.
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What if I don't take it?
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Something's going to happen.
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And I went to back home to the UK and I remember thinking I've got to take lots of it just
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in case, because if I'm stuck, I don't know, I imagine myself mid-flight suddenly having
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It would just be a nightmare.
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So I felt very, um, made me more panicking in a way.
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So you had the stress induced migraines, but migraines were also inducing stress.
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And then, um, and how long did you take that for or how long did that last?
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So I came off them with you.
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I felt like I had a crutch.
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How long was that before?
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I would say a year and a half.
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A year and a half?
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I remember you not liking to take them, which made me relieved because.
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I don't love the idea of taking any kind of medication.
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There's always long, longer term consequences.
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So it actually may bring a relief longer term.
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It adds toxicity on your liver and inside of your large intestine, which in itself creates
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That will make sense.
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So, so I, I quite liked when you said I'm taking it and I'm like, we're not going to
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We're going to, you are going to decide to remove it when you are ready with your doctor,
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And that was a really good approach.
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Cause I'm not kidding.
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I would have just probably dug my heels in a few said the other at that point, because
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even though I knew I didn't want to, I was feeling like this was keeping me safe.
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You need to stay safe.
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You need to feel, you need to feel like I've got this and I take, if I can take, if I can
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afford a few hits because I've been so good for a while, uh, that I actually trust you.
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This is working now.
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We know for like, these are really substances with real effects.
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And if they relieve you, like I probably told you your job is to manage your migraines.
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My job is to remove your migraines.
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But when you have it, the way you manage it, it's really yours.
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And your brother in the equation, like he, he, he finds it normal or he, um, he just,
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um, removes the aggressor.
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So he does not have cheese or chocolate anytime he's going to, um, exercise.
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He has a very structured, but a regime where he exercises and he does not have it bearing
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in mind that a man's body is a lot more simple.
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Um, um, so the, the, the, the cycle is a lot more predictable where the woman, the triggers
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may vary depending on the time of the cycle.
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So it may feel, yeah, exactly.
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It may feel a lot more confusing for us than it is for them, right?
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For them, each time they're going to do something, they're going to have a similar result for
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Each time we do something, we may have a different result, which adds to the confusion.
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And therefore we rely more on our intuition.
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So now then you, there you are.
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So you have now vestibular migraines.
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You've been diagnosed.
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Uh, you understand it's genetic, it's in your family.
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You have the amitriptyline, you live with it.
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And then, and then what happens?
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And then it's funny because it took two different people to tell me to come to you.
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And eventually I thought, okay, I've got to try it, um, and, and I did.
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And then, um, I would like to say you've cured me because I feel you have.
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But I also think what you've done is made me aware of myself, which is almost more important
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than someone else waving a magic wand over you.
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It's giving someone the power to understand what they do will have an impact and how do
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you do, how do you deal with that?
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It's, it's, uh, it's, it's fascinating.
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And I, I, um, I think the way I look at it, um, uh, legally, um, I am personally not allowed
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to use the term cure and, um, it's a term also given its genetic, you know, like I'm
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not changing your genes, but I think what I am doing is I'm teaching you how to use
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And I do think they're really useful because at the end of the day, I deep down in my brain,
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my heart, I really think that your brain has a much longer longevity now.
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I think all of these years is just a warning sign of, Hey, don't abuse, don't do coffee
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Please give me this.
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And once you do, your brain says, Hey, we're good to go.
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We're good to age.
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And I look forward to aging together, but before it sends you these warning signals.
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So for me, it's the migraines, but it's also other stuff that I think the brain is trying
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I think maybe as you get older and you realize, but I mean, it's a bit annoying if you're
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in your twenties and you've got a migraine, but as you get older,
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you do tend to realize that everything, well, perhaps you realize that everything is connected.
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And the more that, you know, it takes experience to realize that, you know, it's the mind,
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it's the body, it's what you're doing, it's what you're putting in your body, it's what
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you're giving out.
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It's all, it's a very holistic situation and you have to, you know, I think maybe the most
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important thing that doing your program has taught me is to be aware of myself and stop
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as soon as I feel a headache coming on, not just go, Oh, let's just get on and carry on
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Cause I'm very used to that.
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It's just a headache.
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It's going to be fine.
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It's a bit of pain.
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And yeah, I remember even when we were, um, doing that exit interview, um, and so I always
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ask, you know, before getting on a call, especially on a zoom call with someone for an hour, which
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has, you know, blue light to it's like, are you comfortable?
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And he said, well, I haven't had an infusion this morning.
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I'm like, well then stop and have it.
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There's no point in me tiring you.
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It's just, it's those reminders, isn't it?
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And, uh, but if you can do that earlier, rather than when you hit my age, even better, that
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would be quite nice to have gone, gone through life.
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Sometimes things happen for a reason when they happen.
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Uh, and, uh, can you talk a bit about, like, you talk about the body as a holistic system.
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Can you talk about some of your other symptoms or, um, I mean, if they're not too personal
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things that you're like, Oh, and that's gone.
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I would have never connected this and that's, well, um, when I get tense, my shoulders,
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I can feel them like just sitting here talking to you.
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I know I'm behaving.
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I'm the best behavior.
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I'm trying to sit properly.
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You know, I can feel I'm getting tense.
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So if I'm feeling that at home, which I, I will, I'm now a bit more tuned in.
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If I'm feeling that at home, I'll roll around on the floor a bit and do some yoga.
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I've become very intuitive because I also think it's part of my kind of, um, you know,
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it's just a nice way of approaching things.
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We're going to do that right after.
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You're going to miss that part.
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We're going to do that right after the.
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I like, I like it and it's part of, and I do daily meditation and I started that.
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I mean, I've done that for 30 years, but I've done it quite intensively in the last two
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Again, I'm probably brought back to it by that kind of feeling of not, of my body being
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out of my control, which is not a nice experience.
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So yeah, that's helped.
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We're talking about the key.
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What were you saying about the indicators?
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I mean, some of the symptoms were around, um, um, it can be, I'm just thinking of your
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profile, maybe sometimes feeling hot, sometimes having a night sweats, sometimes having.
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But that's likely past.
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No, that's really, really good.
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Um, and then what else would there be?
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Like it would be migraines in the evening.
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Like I had dizziness.
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But I've always had low blood pressure as well.
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That was another thing that was sort of allied to potentially the headaches, oh, you've got
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very low blood pressure.
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So that might be it.
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And do you feel more energy and more?
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I feel more energy.
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I think also, um, a good kickstart to any kind of, when you commit to any sort of program,
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Um, you sort of look at all areas of your life.
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You've encouraged me to think about the exercise.
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Um, you've encouraged me to think about, you know, stress levels.
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Um, as well as food.
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And that's, uh, I think when you apply-
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And when you apply-
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Um, you realize that, you know, you get into thought processes that, uh-
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Maybe that's time to meditate.
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Or, uh, what else did we say?
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Uh, um, uh, eating a healthy tooth-
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Which is a really convenient way of saying I want to eat what I want to eat when I want
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It's not a biological situation.
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And also, I think together we've been able to prove, okay, you can be vegetarian-
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And that doesn't say anything about your migraines.
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It's just so many plants in the plant domain.
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I, it's funny one woman asked me recently, she said, Oh, I noticed you never recommend
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Are you against meat?
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And I'm like, no, not at all.
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I, I, I'm not against or in favor of meat.
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I just, that nature has all it takes and, you know, everything, if you want to not have
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And I have to say when, before I came to you, I was nervous as well because we have food
[21:53]
allergies in my house.
[21:55]
And the nuts and the seeds are not allowed in our house.
[21:59]
And, um, and I thought, oh, that was another thing that stopped me coming to you.
[22:03]
I was thinking, oh, she's just going to say, you've got to eat all the nuts and all the
[22:07]
And I can't do that.
[22:09]
We found a way around it.
[22:20]
Well, I just want to say a massive thank you.
[22:21]
Thank you for all of these women who are in that journey on that journey where there's,
[22:22]
uh, things are not understood and it's what you are because you have blue eyes or I've
[22:26]
heard all sorts of things because you're a woman, you have migraines because you're a
[22:31]
Um, you know, um, yeah.
[22:33]
And you just have to accept it and accept, accept, accept, medicate, medicate, medicate.
[22:37]
I think we talk a lot about medication cocktails now, you know, where you take a couple on
[22:42]
top of each other, um, without always thinking of, again, it's going to dry my bowel movement
[22:47]
further because all of that toxicity, which is going to give me longterm more migraines.
[22:51]
And so we, we, we look at things very short term.
[22:55]
So thank you for these women.
[22:57]
Anything that can help.
[22:59]
And then maybe I want to mention last, uh, which is a funny fact, um, we were preparing
[23:04]
this and I was going to have us doing the other way around, um, but you want to talk
[23:08]
a little bit about your profession and then a nice gift that you have.
[23:11]
Oh, it's just, I write about fashion, so, and I've, I've worked in that area for a long
[23:17]
time and, uh, Diane was going to have a side on with the light coming in one side.
[23:23]
You know, that flattering light is this light, so we had to switch around.
[23:33]
And I was very impressed from fashion, um, to write a beautiful article on guts.
[23:38]
Which was really good on gut brain axis and how, um, how foods can help with that gut
[23:45]
Thank you for that too.
[23:46]
Thank you for the input.
[23:48]
Thank you so much.
[23:51]
Sharing is caring.
[23:52]
So share this podcast with your loved ones or whoever it may help.
[24:02]
Follow us on social media to stay updated on our content.
[24:06]
And if you yourself suffer from migraines, then visit our website, uh, mining10hub.com.
[24:14]
Stay well, stay healthy, and stay happy.
